This is fascinating, but we are handing something else over to AI, because it’s smarter than us. I think we are close to politicians asking it “how to run a country which will in turn, enrich my family and friends”. Or are we already there?

It's devolving into a war between corporations and customers and they seem to have all the weapons.

Kerala in India has a long history of electing communist party politicians. It has the highest literacy rate and lowest infant mortality in India due to its policies.

if you change communism to community then you dont have to go very far for an answer

If you shit in a pint glass, it looks like mud!

the family fridge

kibbutzes

German Peasant's War (where the word communism derives), Paris Commune, two Russian revolutions minus the Bolsheviks, Makhnochina, Spanish revolution, German revolution, May 68, etc. etc. etc.

Losing in the first half don't mean the game's over.

The reason you don't hear any success stories is because there ain't none.

Come on down voters give me a success story if you don't like the truth?? Bloody Marxists never except that it doesn't work. What ever iteration you can think of it WONT WORK!!!! everyone being the same sucks the fun out of life accept that hard work pays!

I'm not advocating for Communism but our society is full of people grafting their respective genitalia off that are still struggling financially. The idea that hard work pays ( properly) is a idea propagated by people seeking to exploit the labour of others. Nobody should need to claim benefits whilst working full time and yet...
Fwiw, I do advocate for a mixed economy. Nationalised energy, health, water, public transport etc and luxuries at the will of the free market.

You shouldn't be allowed to claim any benefits while in full time employment. It's crazy, we are basically subsidising employers who ought to be paying more.

And I hope that, one day, employers decide paying a living wage is more important than ever increasing profits such that in work benefits are no longer necessary. I propose a link between maximum and minimum pay within an organisation. Let's say; no pay ( overall package including bonuses, perks and dividends) higher than 5x the lowest full time salary.

it wouldn't even have to be a regulation, the government does business with so many companies and beneficiaries. if they don't have these multiples in place no people's funds.

employers don't make that call so much as owners do and when the owner is the stock market it's quite blind to anything but profits.

when the owners are the employees this changes priorities.

"that hard work pays" is often true and the capitalists don't only pontificate this to the masses they teach it to their children. children they practise communism with.

I’m sure there are loads they just don’t teach us about them. Capitalism doesn’t work either does it? Too many greedy pocket filling bastards. We are all the same having money doesn’t make you better than anyone else, the fact you are here spouting this shows what a sad state the world is in 😞

You should look into some unbiased reporting on the soviet Union, and some witness statements from the older generation who lived through it.

You will find that many of them tell you life was better in the USSR, than in post USSR Eastern Europe and Russia. Besides that they were several decades ahead of the west on womens rights and social services.

But like anything good, the Americans bring it down from the inside, or out, USSR, Great Britain, either way. Their media controls the narritive, and communism effects their ability to steal all the money. There is a reason Cinema is oversaturated with anti Communist rhetoric.

I'd honestly rather have the worst communist government, than be America number 2.

i'd settle for being ireland number 0.5 :)

they currently have more than double the uk's gdp per capita

Yeah and east germany was the most successful communist country of all, just ask anyone that wasn't killed trying to leave.

Have you ever listened to Konstantin Kisin? A Jewish family - He moved when he was 9 from the ussr to England at the end of the soviet Union just before the fall. His first hand account of his own life tells a very different story to what you describe.

under capitalism hard work has never paid and never will pay lmfao. communism actually prioritises labour, capitalism is about fat pigs at the top skimming off 99% of the profit we produce for them. do you not find it utterly insane tesco has like 5 different in-house brands with varying prices for essentially the same product? or that having less money means you have to settle for lower quality products that are worse for you and spoil faster?

So, you don't think lifting 4/5ths of the world out of relative poverty can be considered "paying off"?
OK Che, communism good 🤣👌

there are children starving in this very country

do you have a source for this? not trying to challenge so much as i would like to learn more about it. maybe there is even a way the community could help.

food for the hungry is legit and accepts crypto

there are community outreach programs and obviously government funded systems like food banks to help, but the crisis only really exists because the capitalist system is designed that way. we have the resources to end world hunger but it's not economically beneficial so it will never happen

these are sources on food insecurity in the uk for 2023 and 2024:
https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9209/
https://foodfoundation.org.uk/initiatives/food-insecurity-tracking#tabs/Round-15

Does the existence of those children make anything I said less true?
Strawman though. I didn't make a claim that there is no poverty in any country. I think you missed the qualifiers "relative" and "4/5ths" of the world.
I would say, that "starving" inarguably applies to way less than 1 in 5 children in the UK, US or anywhere in the West which makes your point about the ills of capitalism fairly moot in context.
I am no fan of cronyism, and I don't think capitalism is utopia, but it's insane to try and persuade anybody that communism would do better than this.
Thanks for the downvotes. I have over a thousand upvotes and less than 30 down.
Drop me a line next time you are tipping your bathwater into the atalantic. I'll do it too 🤣

"I have over a thousand upvotes and less than 30 down"

This is one of the saddest things I've ever read on the internet xD

You stop your quotations at an expedient place. If you would have been less disingenuous about your framing, you would be honest about the fact that the reason I said it was to point out that the users who's position I criticised (fairly and civilly) had no reply apart from the futile downvotes, as I was describing.
If I was trying to persuade anybody of anything about me with only what you have entered in your own quotation marks as the context then I'd tend to agree with you. Given that you have totally taken it out of the context it was said (I mean it was clear the previous person was making downvotes vexatiously, in place of an actual cogent argument against what I was saying.
I think you probably know that, but don't care because you disagree with me 🤣 how about tackle me with some argumental substance rather than downvotes.
So, yeah, moot point. Wind your neck in mush.

TLDR

Ah, the Lords prayer of the troll world.
In other words, you have nothing worth saying because you are too vacuous to argue your way out of the little communist hole you dug 🤣
Thick.

There is. It's UK

I came here to say this. Glad someone else knows what's going on.

It's gradual. Socialism is the route to communism. The NHS, which we are all trained from an early age to worship, was one of the first big steps in socialism. Benefits too.

Do you all remember when Richard Madeley of all people called out Susan Michie for being a member of the Communist party? She was a main player in the 'behaviour science' part of the scamdemic. Do you remember how we were all pressured into performing that awful clap for the NHS gesture? That was like something out of North Korea/China, where citizens are softly compelled into worshipping the state - like those obvious crocodile tears that were shed over Kim of N Korea.

Ugh, most people are too close to it to see it but it is ABUNDANTLY clear.

I would recommend anyone to watch Yuri Bezmenovs lecture on how the west gets subverted to Communism. He was a soviet defector who used to subvert countries and bring them into the soviet fold for a living.

@Chambertin4 I wish we lived in the world you think we live in xD

The rich people who own the media want to push an ideology that stops them being able to hoarde all the wealth? care to explain how that makes sense?

im happy living right here

I don't think Communism has ever worked as Capitalists are always creaming off the top.

A great book on the subject is Eat The Rich by the US satirist (and huge drug consumer) P.J. O'Rourke. I think his and my politics are probably polar opposites, but you could get fucked up at a party with him and have an amazing time. Anyway, good book. Breaks down all sorts of different political stances, and Good Communism is one chapter, and Bad Communism another. He's a funny guy, but maybe don't consider it as in depth reasoned academic analysis.

Ah, fuck. He died in 2022. No future parties.

open source software (you're soaking in it)

Best example of communism... in the ground... deep in the ground with the devil from whence it came.

yet when everyone looks above and sees devils we know what cycle communism - or now capitalism - is in.

It doesn't work
Never has, never will.
The communists and socialists will tell you that " it just hasn't been done properly"
Problem is, they always need other peoples money to spend...

The West is the best. Don't have a Mao

The only people with positive stories perished in the gulags.

"It was a laugh in the beginning, but things went steeply downhill shortly after."

seriously the first few years in the gulag are brilliant

Some people apparently laughed themselves to death.

I don't think you'll find any. They've tried it and hundreds of millions died. Ok in principle but man's greed quickly takes over.

yeah it's the trickery of it from the knowers side and the sheer gullibility from the mark.

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his need"

To the naive person, this quote from Marx sounds like everyone will just pull their own weight for others and everyones needs will be met.

But with the benefit of hindsight, it is clearly a recipe for slave labour/the gulag system where each man is worked to his utmost but only has his basic needs met. Pretty clear with the benefit of hindsight.

There are no luxuries. Worked to the max, as much as your body can stand and in return you are provided a concrete bed, thin blanket and bowl of gruel twice a day. From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.

Concrete bed?
This could easily be satire. Thanks for the laughs. xD

It doesn’t work people become lazy and there will always be those who have and those who have nothing.

Argentina’s current turnaround under Javier Milei from socialist basket case to small state and low interference is what you should be talking about. We don’t need the public sector time to slash it.

We need to get our self respect back relying on the state has made us weak and pathetic.

We are already experiencing communism even in the modern world , it's a hybrid between communism and democracy , based on feelings and personal I , me Happiness and DEI.
Don't work , hand outs , nobody knows what a woman is , men are all monsters and rapists , everyone can be whatever they FEEL , massive division - past remembering - payouts for past events , people split into groups protesting, government is everything - Marxsism 1:1 .
You already have 6 - 7 nations that have fallen fighting for this aspect -
Argentina - down - Saved by Milei
Columbia - down
Venezuela - down
Chile - About to fall
Salvador - Down - But saved by Bukele
Australia - About to fall
USA - About to fall - massive border issues and most cities are walking dead with people zombies being poor and homeless.
UK - about to crash due to importing victimhood across all minorities , brits on mute mode not even saying anything to anyone.
Go woke in a country and your entire society crashes.
Capitalism + Merrit Based society is the only one working.
This has been in the works tho since the 90s - starting with the feminisation of men and masculinisation of women - Split up with your men , you can do whatever you want , then they wake up at 40's with a carrer , no fam and alone crying on Socials crying for a men.
Men - don't react , be soft , toxic masculinity , every reaction has been deemed as something is wrong with you.
Therapy is all processed from the perspective of a woman , so men don't go to that.
Men just kill themselves at some point due to loneliness , women keep talking and talking and move on.
This is where you are at in 2024 in the Western World's
So majority of people need to stop and go back to standards otherwise Societies crash entirely , we see the results Live ongoing
North Korea is the only one truly communist spot ON and it's only because the majority of the population simply wants to live like that , they don't know anything else , never did , not every nation is attracted to this notion of rich , poor ,progress yourself some just want to live like in a big Foster care home totally controlled.

My wife, she’s very keen on redistributing my wealth.

None. A demonstrably failed concept.

Cambodia - says it all.

Communism is inherently tyrannical. History shows that. There aren’t any examples of success for a reason. It goes against the human spirit. Millions more died die to its tyranny than under the Nazis but you never see documentaries on the BBC or Netflix about Stalin, Mao or Pol Pot. Capitalism isn’t perfect by a long way but meritocracy is natural and drives progress. People to an extent sort themselves into roles and structures on natural ability and interest. Socialism just teaches people to rely on the state whilst the state gets to dictate how people think and behave. It’s ideological tyranny on the one extreme and financial exploitation of a liberal society by the few on the other. My grandad was a carpenter and paid his subs to his union for years until he acknowledged the financial and ideological corruption that it was based on.

There has never been one.
Governments, inherently are untrustworthy, the larger they are.
More proclivity to tyranny the smaller they are - which the libertarians are blind to.
There should be a lassez faire way to govern, with a balanced and adequately sized government.
Modern progressives don't like to hear this, but capitalism has lifted the world out of relative poverty, to the extent that nothing that came before it has been more beneficial to both quantity and quality of life.
Necessary evils are all around us. We think if we are selective about the ones we talk about, then the ones we don't want to talk about will disappear for some reason.

Do what thou wilt, and harm none

Here's a shot: true liberty results in the destruction of capitalism.

is that from abundance or indifference?v

I find today’s liberal left to be very authoritarian in nature. They use all the kind fluffy buzz words but ram it down your throat with a hot poker.

B.s confirmed. The libertarian/authoritarian is a different axis from the left/right paradigm. The left/right axis doesn't really matter anymore. Classic liberalism much more akin to Conservative values.
The more relevant terms when talking of the laissez-faire ideas are whether you are a consequentialist, or deontological libertarian I.e: do consequences matter or is it the rules that matter?

Very interesting perspective but who determines the consequences or the rules?

The government determine the rules, generally speaking don't they?
The consequentialist libertarian generally would say that they are not against force (by government)per se, but they believe in strong private property rights because it generally makes people happy and prosperous when they have them.

it makes sense: private property for what we create, public property for what's already sitting on the planet.

The Beano is as much an encyclopedia as Wikipedia. https://libcom.org/article/libertarian-marxist-tendency-map + any anarcho history from Bakunin and Stirner onward.

It's Leftism without the authoritarianism.

A true president like that and the only one in the world is Milei Argentina , guy saved his country from crashing down due to importing US values in mostly a Traditional hard working country.

I think capitalism ends in so much abundance that no one gives a shit.

We're in the widening gap phase now for sure, or at least its becoming clear how far the gap already is.

The final step in every Marxism based cycle is the uprising of the proletariat, so that's the fun bit we need to look towards.. lol :)

WS

0% interest rates, meme stocks, puts and calls going up simultaneously, sure looks like an end game scenario.

The Man realised a long time ago ;-)

"Capitalism does not permit an even flow of economic resources. With this system, a small privileged few are rich beyond conscience, and almost all others are doomed to be poor at some level. That's the way the system works. And since we know that the system will not change the rules, we are going to have to change the system." Martin Luther King, Jr.

The big flaw of capitalism..
One day all the super rich (super useless) will realize the world seizes to go round without ground level hard workers and skilled people.

you mean robots, right? ;0

I doubt Communism unfolded exactly how he predicted... so at least he got it half right.

Cheers BB 😁👍🍻💚

Not quite. "The working class cannot simply lay hold of the ready-made state machinery, and wield it for its own purposes".

Too true 😅

Absolutely. I encourage you all to read the manifesto if you haven't already. It will blow your mind how accurately he describes the current situation in capitalism. I'm a proud member of the one of the fastest growing communist party worldwide, and we're working had to organise and educate people on how communism would work in the 21st century. DM me if you're interested. I could talk communism all day long.

whats the elevator pitch?

I love these talks....but let me take the opposing side of the view and say the real reason capitalism works and proven to work than communism (even communist countries like China has no option but to conform to capitalist notions)...Is because of it's destructive & Contradictory nature which allows room for error, destruction and reconstruct....Flexibility like biology of trial and error that leads eventually to efficiency....So yes there are aspects of communism that needs to be involved and would allow under capitalism....But not necessarily Viseversa....

Finally Communism has historically tried and Achieved Growth without sustainability.....So it has already proven not correct in REAL TERMS!

BUT we should look for a confluence between two and integrate to create a better system....again think of China and their growth spurt over the last 2-decades....this is after they have allowed Capitalist ideas to be joined with communism....

I just said all my perspective and please forgive me if there is anything incorrect ...this based on my limmited knowledge

I think there has always been feudalism in one form or another. There is always a class that ultimately owns everything because they can confiscate it, grant it a "title" or tax it. This premise always leads to same outcome it's just a matter of how greedy or insane the current landlord is.

Everything consolidates one way or another, thats why decentralization is both great and doomed.

Anthropologist David Graeber did a book about about this myth called Debt. There is no evidence for class dominant economics bar this relatively small and recent period of time. Obviously the myth has more value than the reality.

interesting dude, thanks for the tip

probably starting from the neolithic era yes with the only exception of the 20th century, the only period of history where people got a bit of control of the power. Now is going to be lost for decades to come.

We need to look on the bright side, we are actually free serfs. We are free to seek a new master and we can seek redress in the crown courts, unfree serfs couldn't. However if we hadn't spent so much bit coin here we might actually be free with the value of it now.

sometimes a imagine a stack of the coins over time and shiver. so then i buy more weed.

Wise words, Jared Diamond's Guns, Germs and Steel says the same but takes 350 odd pages.

yes, were hard wired for this shit

Nice hook

Thanks for sharing.

I see examples of this not just on the internet but in all industries. Walk down most high streets here in the UK and they now pretty much all look identical the same shops, coffee shops and chain restaurants with very few independent offerings. The cost of rent, business rates and all the red tape make it pretty much impossible nowadays for small independents to even start up.

Watching a show about fisherman on the BBC painted a picture of the EU quota system they must use and how the industry is dominated by money and huge boats and how these owners buy up small fishing boats and take the quotas these boats have to use on the mega trawlers.

The car industry seems totally monopolised now and we actually get very little choice - notice how the different makers share chassis and engines and the only real difference you get is the interior and badge. Everything else is pretty much controlled by rules and regulations.

It is obvious that these big players of industry are in cahoots with the those that set the rules and regulations as we saw with the emissions scandal with VW and EU collaboration.

Covid and lockdowns have exacerbated the situation as many small business owners left without any financial supports have gone to the wall while government loans to the huge corporations sit unused in their bank accounts.

Truly depressing times.

This is the model dreamed up by Gabrielle D'Nunzio, Mussolini, Franco and later tried by Stroessner, Pinochet and Thatcher. Always fails cos tho i am a committed capitalist even i realise extraction cannot work for ever as either you run out of victims (Franco, Pinochet) or the victims turn on you (Mussolini, Thatcher) At least Il Duce didn't cry when his turn came, Thatcher mewled and puked like a rat.

thatcher was as much a military dictator as she was latin

Fascinating. Bleak. truly people have been brainwashed by the media and now vote with their wallets. Far more regulation required at the top end, we cant stop the progress, and in many ways it serves us well. Democracy can still win the day, and we can unite for the good of all people. Education is the key, and a few good humans can change the world. It cant be allowed that rampant free market capitalism destroys us. Roll on technical singularity, according to Moores law would be around 2042 but i believe the theory is faultering (Moores law) so might take a bit longer. Technological growth becomes uncontrollable and irreversible, resulting in unforeseeable changes to human civilization. We have just leisure time so we study philosophy and all becone enlightened beings living in a tech utopia. Peace

Moore's law is doing fine once you abstract it to include progress besides chip density. Computation overall is on track when you include advances in software and a.i.

it will take more than economics for everyone to spend their leisure time studying philosophy. but im with you at least

Hope so but would we be the same beings, even the same species? I think Nietszche was mostly a clown but "homo, ecce homo" hits home

What is Neo Feudalism and being British mean?

Neo-feudalism refers to a concept that draws parallels between modern societal structures and the feudal system of the Middle Ages. It suggests that power and wealth are concentrated in the hands of a few influential individuals or entities, leading to a significant wealth disparity and limited social mobility. In a neo-feudalistic system, there may be an entrenched hierarchy, with a small elite class exerting control over economic, political, and social aspects, while the majority of the population faces limited opportunities and struggles to improve their circumstances.

Being British refers to being a citizen or a resident of the United Kingdom or having a connection to British culture and heritage. It typically implies a sense of national identity associated with the customs, traditions, and values of the British people. It encompasses aspects such as the English language, British history, British institutions, and cultural practices that are prevalent in the UK. However, it's important to note that "being British" can mean different things to different people, as it can encompass a diverse range of identities and perspectives within the multicultural society of the United Kingdom,

digital land barons & their consumers

Like the last feudal era they will ultimately fail IMO. Biden, bezos, bj and the two conos in NZ & Canada are only one mad bomber away from losing all the kleptocratic gains they have extracted. Putin and Xi poss a battalion or two away. Even if the above are stopped there are always despots trying their luck. The better angels of our nature (thanks Pinker, S) have always stayed in the fight so that the new boss is NOT always the same as the old boss (thanks Townshend, P)

I think his graph answers your question: Pretty Fuckin Soon

It doesn’t sound like we need a whole lot of people more like!

This. The whole idea of humans working for money starts changing when all of the work is done by AI and robots. Think how different a shared self driving car is to a couple of clunkers parked in every garage on stand by, it up-ends the premise of cars, transport, housing to say nothing of alcohol use, multi-tasking and God knows what else. Now think of everything else being done by robots and you and your friends spending lots of time in VR, it's not like you're going to take off the glasses and work at some factory in this scenario.

People would just do what they wanted to do. People wouldn’t be chasing money, but chasing their passions. I was a chef for two years, but fucked it off because the money and hours were shit! If money wasn’t an object and I could do it when I felt like it then that’s what I’d do.

so thats why theres negative interest rates

Read life 3.0 by max tegmark. There is a vast community funded by Elon Musk reseraching AI and its potential as we speak. I wonder if the Simpsons can predict the eventuality that machines could become superior to humans like they did with forecasting Donald Trump as President.

yeah they oughta add an a.i. character for homer to play off of

Don't worry about it, AI will figure it out for us.

But the bottom line is, the corporations that are investing in AI still need to make their profits too. If no one works, no one has money, so how would these corporations stay afloat?

There will need to be some sort of equilibrium - much as (most) humans now realise we can't keep burning Earth's resources, AI systems wouldn't be programmed to make humanity defunct. Not unless the world manages to move away from its capitalist consumerist ambitions; which it won't. We're greedy creatures.

if everything we want is fed by an ai created vr feed we may still be consumers but things gonna be damn cheap.

atms resulted in more bank branches and overall, more tellers.

Once the textile loom has finished devastating the working landscape.

Lol the luddites are still operating against the looms as we speak. Especially up North.

i thought you were joking so i looked it up. ffs

For the moment, we are safe. They haven't even managed to get self checkouts working properly yet, so I'm not getting in a driverless car. All it takes is a sensor to fail, and it's game over. I work with sensors - you wouldn't want to get in a driverless car for a long while.


Automation - whole different ballgame, and this is the real fear

To understand that, you first have to understand who have control of the world. eventually you find the source being that of the "Red Shield" family. which then gives you their agenda, they see the rest of us as "goyim" having a belief we are to serve them as upgraded animals. So, they have to destroy the existing system to usher in a new having what we term "image of the beast" possibly representing AI as the brains behind their new agenda. We, therefore will enter a stage where the elite/red shield family give a choice to either obey and conform to them or to be hunted down like sheep for slaughter. The ones who accept will receive a mark to accept credits. China recently started this endeavour which fits perfectly with their zionist regime and called it "Social Credit" http://uk.businessinsider.com/china-social-credit-system-punishments-and-rewards-explained-2018-4?r=US&IR=T, however, those who have understanding will flee from their demise into the wilderness for this has been written already. They call themselves Jews but are not (Revelation 2:9) thus the third temple will not be as they claim, possibly even having AI rule over the population whilst the AC rule over their temple.

I think you need to stop smoking so much weed dude... and maybe stop reading so much geopolitical and religious fiction too!

Seems like negative interest rates are post scarcity for money.

finding little biggy :)

a pipe dream, even with free replication of everything people find a way to have scarcity. look at what people pay for things in game worlds.

When you’re waiting for your pack from little biggy but it’s not in todays post.

Something nfts really hate

Star Trek

shortage of credible acting, don't that count for anything?