if you change communism to community then you dont have to go very far for an answer

If you shit in a pint glass, it looks like mud!

if you put mud in a pint glass it takes like shit

the family fridge

I don't think Communism has ever worked as Capitalists are always creaming off the top.

A great book on the subject is Eat The Rich by the US satirist (and huge drug consumer) P.J. O'Rourke. I think his and my politics are probably polar opposites, but you could get fucked up at a party with him and have an amazing time. Anyway, good book. Breaks down all sorts of different political stances, and Good Communism is one chapter, and Bad Communism another. He's a funny guy, but maybe don't consider it as in depth reasoned academic analysis.

Ah, fuck. He died in 2022. No future parties.

kibbutzes

The reason you don't hear any success stories is because there ain't none.

Come on down voters give me a success story if you don't like the truth?? Bloody Marxists never except that it doesn't work. What ever iteration you can think of it WONT WORK!!!! everyone being the same sucks the fun out of life accept that hard work pays!

I'm not advocating for Communism but our society is full of people grafting their respective genitalia off that are still struggling financially. The idea that hard work pays ( properly) is a idea propagated by people seeking to exploit the labour of others. Nobody should need to claim benefits whilst working full time and yet...
Fwiw, I do advocate for a mixed economy. Nationalised energy, health, water, public transport etc and luxuries at the will of the free market.

Exactly this - capitalism needs the grafters, the hardworking cogs to keep coming in to replace those that fall off or fall through the cracks.

"that hard work pays" is often true and the capitalists don't only pontificate this to the masses they teach it to their children. children they practise communism with.

You shouldn't be allowed to claim any benefits while in full time employment. It's crazy, we are basically subsidising employers who ought to be paying more.

And I hope that, one day, employers decide paying a living wage is more important than ever increasing profits such that in work benefits are no longer necessary. I propose a link between maximum and minimum pay within an organisation. Let's say; no pay ( overall package including bonuses, perks and dividends) higher than 5x the lowest full time salary.

it wouldn't even have to be a regulation, the government does business with so many companies and beneficiaries. if they don't have these multiples in place no people's funds.

employers don't make that call so much as owners do and when the owner is the stock market it's quite blind to anything but profits.

when the owners are the employees this changes priorities.

I’m sure there are loads they just don’t teach us about them. Capitalism doesn’t work either does it? Too many greedy pocket filling bastards. We are all the same having money doesn’t make you better than anyone else, the fact you are here spouting this shows what a sad state the world is in 😞

under capitalism hard work has never paid and never will pay lmfao. communism actually prioritises labour, capitalism is about fat pigs at the top skimming off 99% of the profit we produce for them. do you not find it utterly insane tesco has like 5 different in-house brands with varying prices for essentially the same product? or that having less money means you have to settle for lower quality products that are worse for you and spoil faster?

So, you don't think lifting 4/5ths of the world out of relative poverty can be considered "paying off"?
OK Che, communism good 🤣👌

there are children starving in this very country

do you have a source for this? not trying to challenge so much as i would like to learn more about it. maybe there is even a way the community could help.

food for the hungry is legit and accepts crypto

there are community outreach programs and obviously government funded systems like food banks to help, but the crisis only really exists because the capitalist system is designed that way. we have the resources to end world hunger but it's not economically beneficial so it will never happen

these are sources on food insecurity in the uk for 2023 and 2024:
https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9209/
https://foodfoundation.org.uk/initiatives/food-insecurity-tracking#tabs/Round-15

Does the existence of those children make anything I said less true?
Strawman though. I didn't make a claim that there is no poverty in any country. I think you missed the qualifiers "relative" and "4/5ths" of the world.
I would say, that "starving" inarguably applies to way less than 1 in 5 children in the UK, US or anywhere in the West which makes your point about the ills of capitalism fairly moot in context.
I am no fan of cronyism, and I don't think capitalism is utopia, but it's insane to try and persuade anybody that communism would do better than this.
Thanks for the downvotes. I have over a thousand upvotes and less than 30 down.
Drop me a line next time you are tipping your bathwater into the atalantic. I'll do it too 🤣

Ah, the Lords prayer of the troll world.
In other words, you have nothing worth saying because you are too vacuous to argue your way out of the little communist hole you dug 🤣
Thick.

found the reddit moderator 😂

Do you mean the actual communists who don't want to respond to fair and cogent points about their lack of reasoning?

i'd settle for being ireland number 0.5 :)

they currently have more than double the uk's gdp per capita

Yeah and east germany was the most successful communist country of all, just ask anyone that wasn't killed trying to leave.

Have you ever listened to Konstantin Kisin? A Jewish family - He moved when he was 9 from the ussr to England at the end of the soviet Union just before the fall. His first hand account of his own life tells a very different story to what you describe.

love triggernometry

The communists on this thread think KK first hand account of late soviet communism is invalid for some reason.
I suspect many of them have never listened to a reasonable, adult centrist common sense. Perhaps it is not synonymous with the cult like adherence to social, political orthodoxy that would like to see nebulous victimhood everywhere.

Hey man, great discussion, and I'm no authority but I had to retort to your 'hard work pays' comment: I have to disagree, hard work doesn't pay - call me whatever but nurses, teachers, delivery drivers, anyone in public service, works their asses off for little pay and much abuse from all sides.

We exist in Capitalism and while hard work and 'hustle' works for a short period for a small number, hard work is not a critical proponent of Capitalism, that's increasingly evident, imo.

Nice alt greenbeans/cherry cola. I can't believe you are actually calling other people schizo and creating multiple accounts to appear to support yourself 🤣

you are a literal schizo, my comment was just insulting you for being a pathetic redditor bragging about 1000 upvotes ,never mentioned politics, this guys actually responding with points and now you dont respond because you schizophrenically think im him. 😂😂😂

hilarious thanks for proving your sanity

You didn't respond with any political talk aside from your comment about reddit that makes NO sense. Yes, you really didn't. But you did downvote every comment I made on this thread within a minute when you appeared on it before we had any interaction. Just as restricted account Tiger man did 🤣

you bragged about having 1000 upvotes which is pathetic redditor behaviour 😂 not that difficult to figure out as long as you arent an obsessed psychotic responding 5 times to a little comment, oh wait 😂😂😂

I'm actually really surprised that you are hating on reddit. There are so many commies on there that want everybody else to do the hard work for them. Sounds up your street.

There is. It's UK

I came here to say this. Glad someone else knows what's going on.

It's gradual. Socialism is the route to communism. The NHS, which we are all trained from an early age to worship, was one of the first big steps in socialism. Benefits too.

Do you all remember when Richard Madeley of all people called out Susan Michie for being a member of the Communist party? She was a main player in the 'behaviour science' part of the scamdemic. Do you remember how we were all pressured into performing that awful clap for the NHS gesture? That was like something out of North Korea/China, where citizens are softly compelled into worshipping the state - like those obvious crocodile tears that were shed over Kim of N Korea.

Ugh, most people are too close to it to see it but it is ABUNDANTLY clear.

I would recommend anyone to watch Yuri Bezmenovs lecture on how the west gets subverted to Communism. He was a soviet defector who used to subvert countries and bring them into the soviet fold for a living.

im happy living right here

i think all the best examples of communism are monuments

open source software (you're soaking in it)

I don't think you'll find any. They've tried it and hundreds of millions died. Ok in principle but man's greed quickly takes over.

yeah it's the trickery of it from the knowers side and the sheer gullibility from the mark.

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his need"

To the naive person, this quote from Marx sounds like everyone will just pull their own weight for others and everyones needs will be met.

But with the benefit of hindsight, it is clearly a recipe for slave labour/the gulag system where each man is worked to his utmost but only has his basic needs met. Pretty clear with the benefit of hindsight.

There are no luxuries. Worked to the max, as much as your body can stand and in return you are provided a concrete bed, thin blanket and bowl of gruel twice a day. From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.

Yes, the realities of a fringe political experiment that has resulted in serious human disaster and loss of life every single time it has been tried makes great satire if you have your head so far in the sand that you can't and won't learn from the past. Come on Che, you are convincing nobody with your smarmy , condescending replies that do not rebut the subject matter. It's totally lazy.

“Best examples of communism”? A bourgeois framing! The Paris Commune—1871—was the first workers’ government: producers seized power, abolished class privilege. Short-lived, but its essence: *proletarian dictatorship* as communism’s midwife. True communism isn’t a “model”—it’s the *movement* to bury capital.

My wife, she’s very keen on redistributing my wealth.

It doesn't work
Never has, never will.
The communists and socialists will tell you that " it just hasn't been done properly"
Problem is, they always need other peoples money to spend...

None. A demonstrably failed concept.

The West is the best. Don't have a Mao

The only people with positive stories perished in the gulags.

"It was a laugh in the beginning, but things went steeply downhill shortly after."

seriously the first few years in the gulag are brilliant

Some people apparently laughed themselves to death.

Ants 🐜

If we ask what communism is attempting which is elimination of hierarchy, collective ownership and resource equality it looks good on the surface but in reality if you look at Cuba and ask any Cuban that managed to fled the country they will tell you when communism is applied through force and suppression it disrupts and destroys instead of harmonising. Sadly we feel it never comes without corruption at it's core...maybe Vietnam?

Its a pipe dream, we are all living under an authoritarian dictatorship disguised as something else and it doesn't matter where you are that's just how it is.
What doesn't seem to be understood is that despite what you are led to believe nearly everyone in the world has more in common with eachother than they don't and non of the current leadership, the oligarchs or the current appointed shop floor managers (politicians) aren't doing anything about it.
And to get a rise from people.
China is winning on making it better and we are not allowed to participate in that.
Although realistically China is winning at the current version and realistically China has always been winning except for a minor blip.

Not exactly a success story but interesting fact. There are more cannabis users per capita in Communist North Korea than there are in any other country. They smoke to relieve the pain of living there.

Best example of communism... in the ground... deep in the ground with the devil from whence it came.

yet when everyone looks above and sees devils we know what cycle communism - or now capitalism - is in.

Cambodia - says it all.

It doesn’t work people become lazy and there will always be those who have and those who have nothing.

Argentina’s current turnaround under Javier Milei from socialist basket case to small state and low interference is what you should be talking about. We don’t need the public sector time to slash it.

We need to get our self respect back relying on the state has made us weak and pathetic.

We are already experiencing communism even in the modern world , it's a hybrid between communism and democracy , based on feelings and personal I , me Happiness and DEI.
Don't work , hand outs , nobody knows what a woman is , men are all monsters and rapists , everyone can be whatever they FEEL , massive division - past remembering - payouts for past events , people split into groups protesting, government is everything - Marxsism 1:1 .
You already have 6 - 7 nations that have fallen fighting for this aspect -
Argentina - down - Saved by Milei
Columbia - down
Venezuela - down
Chile - About to fall
Salvador - Down - But saved by Bukele
Australia - About to fall
USA - About to fall - massive border issues and most cities are walking dead with people zombies being poor and homeless.
UK - about to crash due to importing victimhood across all minorities , brits on mute mode not even saying anything to anyone.
Go woke in a country and your entire society crashes.
Capitalism + Merrit Based society is the only one working.
This has been in the works tho since the 90s - starting with the feminisation of men and masculinisation of women - Split up with your men , you can do whatever you want , then they wake up at 40's with a carrer , no fam and alone crying on Socials crying for a men.
Men - don't react , be soft , toxic masculinity , every reaction has been deemed as something is wrong with you.
Therapy is all processed from the perspective of a woman , so men don't go to that.
Men just kill themselves at some point due to loneliness , women keep talking and talking and move on.
This is where you are at in 2024 in the Western World's
So majority of people need to stop and go back to standards otherwise Societies crash entirely , we see the results Live ongoing
North Korea is the only one truly communist spot ON and it's only because the majority of the population simply wants to live like that , they don't know anything else , never did , not every nation is attracted to this notion of rich , poor ,progress yourself some just want to live like in a big Foster care home totally controlled.

Communism is inherently tyrannical. History shows that. There aren’t any examples of success for a reason. It goes against the human spirit. Millions more died die to its tyranny than under the Nazis but you never see documentaries on the BBC or Netflix about Stalin, Mao or Pol Pot. Capitalism isn’t perfect by a long way but meritocracy is natural and drives progress. People to an extent sort themselves into roles and structures on natural ability and interest. Socialism just teaches people to rely on the state whilst the state gets to dictate how people think and behave. It’s ideological tyranny on the one extreme and financial exploitation of a liberal society by the few on the other. My grandad was a carpenter and paid his subs to his union for years until he acknowledged the financial and ideological corruption that it was based on.

retard can't even spell laissez-faire 😂😂😂😂😂😂

Retard can't even argue against the substance of my position.
You've not made one good point about anything on this thread 🤣

The Catholics needed a pedant on their side not a pendant. Taken literally this position gets a lot easier to defend.

I'm not sure trying to peg any organisation as objectively good or bad is possible, but also fuck the Catholic Church and all they are.

This reminds me of a Jam lyric: "We were no match for their untamed wit".

I was raised catholic and this is seriously the best joke I’ve read on this site lmao

Mass murder; centuries of child abuse, financial manipulation of countries and its peoples, stifling science for centuries, masses of lies and corruption, manipulating the world, controlling the weak minded, instilling a ridiculous morality onto its followers that only incites hatred and misery

The catholic churuch is just the greatest group of criminals to ever exist

God I’m so proud to be catholic 😂

You forgot to include wealthiest, if the Roman Catholic Church realised all it's assets then they could probably eradicate world poverty in a year

Facts

Edgy.

I don't think I've ever heard or seen Widdicombe and not immediately wanted to scrape my eyes out and shove dynamite in my ears.

What a horrificly horrible and hateful person she is. Eugh

We know you want her.

who wouldnt

I don't like Anne Widdecombe at all, but from what I remember from this debate (I watched it a few years ago) she switched from Christianity to Catholoisim because of the amount of hypocrisy in the C of E.

Now don't even get me started on the hypocrisy in the Catholic Church, but I must admit I do somewhat sympathise with the point she was making.

You can't have a religion based upon a book that says "we don't agree with homosexuality" then just ignore that view because it's no longer popular.

It's like the Christian Church is now willing to ignore any of its doctrines just to remain "relevant", and get some likes on Twitter.

If you're going to be a bigoted religion, at least own it.

I'm not really into arguing about religion or politics, and I'm neither religious nor particularly political, but I do have to admit a begrudging respect for any religion that at least sticks by it's dogmatic roots, however ridiculous those roots are.

That's pretty much all I got from Widdicombe that was worth thinking about.

The rest of her nonsense....isn't worth anyone's time.

Cheers BB 😊👍🍻

All versions of Christianity ignore some parts of the bible because it's not popular. The Bible says not to wear two different types of fabric at once, and to sell your daughter to her rapist, but no Christians are abiding by that. They are all as bad as each other, to pretend like she's calling out hypocrisy by changing from one hateful religion to another is so deceitful, another part of the reason she is scum.

starting to sound like a fun read, any sightings?

Dunno if you ever saw her debating with Stephen Fry and I think Chris Hitchins or possibly Jordan Peterson at Oxford? Between them they gave her the best fucking she's ever had

Jesus is King

are there any gods that support democracy?

laugh all you like but the basic philosophy of jesus is love and that is exactly what the world needs.

Yet his loudest followers scream at women at abortion clinics, promote violence towards gay people and basically act like 15th century bigots with torches

Doesn’t sound very loving to me, sounds more like a relationship with Ike Turner

Jesus spoke beautiful words but they’ve been twisted and manipulated to spread hate not love by the loudest “believers” as evidenced in every evil act done in the name of Jesus or Christianity

I’m gonna stick to worshipping the truest deity known to man- our lady and saviour MARY JANE 🤣

with that but the question remains

Yes but they die in an apocalyptic battle with stupidity

yea sure why not, in general i think the catholic church is a force for good in the world

Let's have a look at bit of history:
1) Reconquista of Spain - overcame the previous more liberal Islamic Al-Andalus. Explusion of Jews & Muslims
2) The cultural rape of the Americas - effectively extinguishing the native way of life
3) All of those European wars which were pretty much Catholics vs Prods (Prods as bad as Catholics in this case)
4) More recently - at a time of AIDs and other STDs saying use of condoms 'evil'.
5) Messing up the psyche of its followers by seeing sex as dirty
6) A great place to work as a preist if you don't like adult women and prefer to have sex with under age boys and girls.

Boooom

If I were a smart man I’d have worded my reply this well haha

Love use of such modern issues caused by the church, generally people seem to think the evil they’ve done is centuries ago, but there’s so much in modern history; in living memory that prevents catholism from ever being objectively “good”

Every super power has its good and evil sides too it it’s up too you to keep them balanced in the right way.

Already seen this you don't want to know my take as a Satanic/pagan Witch/warlock ... But i agree with stephen about most things. The part i can't stomach is that The church brag (Or used to) about their il educated followers from africa.. one reason why i returned to the ways of my old english ancestors.. in all things balance and respect for nature and our home.. Ave Lucifer the light bringer and Giver of knowlage .. Ave lilith mother of all witches and reflection of the black sun.

Pitching the devil sounds like an interesting line of work.

pay is great just ask jk rowling

the word Devil means adversary... Rowling XD are you another one of those magic is the work of the devil hacks??

not the devil but the witch king look up traditional witchcraft...

"Giver of knowlage..."

Well that all sounds pretty knowlagabel to me.

Were do I syne up?

Cheers BB 👌

XD lucifer before the bible... In Roman folklore, Lucifer was the name of the planet Venus, Also worshiped as a wisdom god.

Is spelling and grammar not a part of "wisdom and knowledge?" (or knowlage)

You'd have thought the old Lucibubs would've at least armed you with a dictionary.

Anyway, each to their own. ❤️

Cheers BB 😊👍🍻

this explans it better https://partiallyexaminedlife.com/2020/02/25/lucifer-how-a-decent-deity-got-a-bad-rap-part-1/ and i was never very good at eather of those i was always more creative. XD i'll be the first one to admit i can't spell and my grammer since the net has gone to pot ... XD

There's nothing wrong with having limited spelling and grammar buddy, but I struggle to understand why you would come on here claiming "wisdom and knowledge" given to you by some dark force when you can't even spell the words properly....

I know nothing about open heart surgery, so I'm not going to claim I have "specialism in the field" when it's very clear I don't.

Wisdom has nothing to do with education, but to claim you have wisdom AND knowledge, because you worship the devil...

Yet you can't even spell 'knowledge'...

Sorry. But that needed to be called out.

Spelling and grammar are nothing. Manners maketh the man.

All the best and like I say, each to their own just please don't claim to have superiority in wisdom and knowledge by worshiping anyone, least of all the devil and witches.

Cheers BB

i don't worship any deity i work with them and i never claimed they gave me anything. the last part of what i said was just Veting or honouring the witch king and queen ( the male and female aspects of nature) i never claimed anything...

Fair enough buddy, sorry if I got the wrong end of the stick.

All the best ❤️

Cheers BB 😊

No problem BB also Keats and Einstein (sry for the spelling) couldn't spell so saying somone is not wise because they can't spell i feel is redundant. i guess what im trying to say even the dumbest of us can be wise. I mean even the dimist of sparks like myself still puts out a little light :)

Now you're making me feel bad. 😔 Sorry. I do post derogatory shit sometimes when I'm awake late.

You keep doing your thing buddy if it makes you happy.

Much love to you. ❤️

Cheers BB 😊🍻

same G we are not perfect only human after all eh ? :) And i will, I feel what ever faith or not anyone follows if it makes them a better person it can only be a good thing right ? ... i just feel some where along the path people started to use it for control and not to help and heal..