I think his graph answers your question: Pretty Fuckin Soon

If any AI and robots do the work without getting paid it doesn't sound like we need a whole lot of money.

It doesn’t sound like we need a whole lot of people more like!

This. The whole idea of humans working for money starts changing when all of the work is done by AI and robots. Think how different a shared self driving car is to a couple of clunkers parked in every garage on stand by, it up-ends the premise of cars, transport, housing to say nothing of alcohol use, multi-tasking and God knows what else. Now think of everything else being done by robots and you and your friends spending lots of time in VR, it's not like you're going to take off the glasses and work at some factory in this scenario.

so thats why theres negative interest rates

Don't worry about it, AI will figure it out for us.

But the bottom line is, the corporations that are investing in AI still need to make their profits too. If no one works, no one has money, so how would these corporations stay afloat?

There will need to be some sort of equilibrium - much as (most) humans now realise we can't keep burning Earth's resources, AI systems wouldn't be programmed to make humanity defunct. Not unless the world manages to move away from its capitalist consumerist ambitions; which it won't. We're greedy creatures.

if everything we want is fed by an ai created vr feed we may still be consumers but things gonna be damn cheap.

Read life 3.0 by max tegmark. There is a vast community funded by Elon Musk reseraching AI and its potential as we speak. I wonder if the Simpsons can predict the eventuality that machines could become superior to humans like they did with forecasting Donald Trump as President.

yeah they oughta add an a.i. character for homer to play off of

atms resulted in more bank branches and overall, more tellers.

Once the textile loom has finished devastating the working landscape.

Lol the luddites are still operating against the looms as we speak. Especially up North.

i thought you were joking so i looked it up. ffs

For the moment, we are safe. They haven't even managed to get self checkouts working properly yet, so I'm not getting in a driverless car. All it takes is a sensor to fail, and it's game over. I work with sensors - you wouldn't want to get in a driverless car for a long while.


Automation - whole different ballgame, and this is the real fear

To understand that, you first have to understand who have control of the world. eventually you find the source being that of the "Red Shield" family. which then gives you their agenda, they see the rest of us as "goyim" having a belief we are to serve them as upgraded animals. So, they have to destroy the existing system to usher in a new having what we term "image of the beast" possibly representing AI as the brains behind their new agenda. We, therefore will enter a stage where the elite/red shield family give a choice to either obey and conform to them or to be hunted down like sheep for slaughter. The ones who accept will receive a mark to accept credits. China recently started this endeavour which fits perfectly with their zionist regime and called it "Social Credit" http://uk.businessinsider.com/china-social-credit-system-punishments-and-rewards-explained-2018-4?r=US&IR=T, however, those who have understanding will flee from their demise into the wilderness for this has been written already. They call themselves Jews but are not (Revelation 2:9) thus the third temple will not be as they claim, possibly even having AI rule over the population whilst the AC rule over their temple.

I think you need to stop smoking so much weed dude... and maybe stop reading so much geopolitical and religious fiction too!

I love this guy he says we are headed to Star Trek Communism or Matrix feudalism.

Greece was the experiment. An entire nation sold out by a couple of politicians one of which was this chap.

He is like a left wing Jordan Peterson making lots of money writing about the obvious that most fail to see.

Tell me you don't know what happened in Greece without telling me lol. The EU and IMF sold out Greece, Yannis was trying to negotiate fair terms for it's debt. Same thing happened to Ireland and Spain.

Jordan Peterson is a fraud, comparing Yannis to him is ludicrous.

Agreed ✅

It took two complicit Greek politicians one of which was Yannis.

The Greek economy was already fucked well before Syriza got into power, infact that's why they got elected, because the previous governments had let the IMF break the country.

The financial crisis and Greek failure happened between 2009-2015, Yannis was elected in 2015 so to try blame them for anything before 2015 is a straight up lie.

And he and them lasted 6 months, after agreeing to austerity like the last lot. With no irony, Syriza means radical. Bout as radical as Pat Sharp.

I feel politicians are the guys we are able to blame

But the true blame is for those powers above which politicians have little to no control over

Post-reality innit?

We will thrive in these new and bewildering times. We have a head start on all the rubes. 🤣✊

What a great person

Read a book by him

“And the weak must suffer what they must”

Really delved into the problems with current banking systems and how it failed the Greek economy of which he was the finance minister of

An eye opener

Total abundance from our machine producers.

if you take the perspective of the past haven't we already achieved this?

Why does it always have to fall under some strict labels that are always massive trigger words for certain people

can we just not label it anything and just fucking make logical decisions that are in the best interest of everyone instead of a few, fuck the strict criteria and labels

Carl saying "I don't know what a socialist is" at the start of the video is every conversation i've had about this with friends or other people, always try to immediately label me something and condense my views into a single word that they can then label me with

Feudalism is many times older than capitalism, and ordained by God. Still fell like a sack of shit.

It'll have a different name and iconography but communism still the only alternative. Just no leaders, no parties, no states, max automation.

Communism fails by the idea of implementation of communism - Don't you think that someone still needs to make sure that its enforced ... Thereby creating back parties, leaders, States and Hierarchies of governing ..... I am not sure but its just a thought.

Sorry did not mean to intervene.

i think this is the potential of decentralisation. it's not perfect but bitcoin has no enforcer but code.

The soviet in the tongue in cheek Soviet Union, means workers' councils. One person, one vote, with an elected delegate representing that be recalled anytime. One council for each workplace, and so on, all the way up. By function, it'd preclude states, parties or leaders.

capitalism is an economic system, and an excellent one at that. it is not, however, a political, philosophical or ethical system. adam smith himself pointed out that without temper from (for him, christian) ethics it would become monstrous. obviously, nobody believes any of that hypocritical, puerile (christian) shite anymore, but that is what needs replacing - the moral component. hard right ideologues that think the market knows best, and that money is some sort of god to be worshipped are stupid shits, and have been shown to be. they have fucked up everything they have touched and only crazy frightened old people don't see that. do not forget, though that socialists have not just fucked up everything they have touched, they have murdered, oppressed and starved people in ways that ghengis khan would have been ashamed of. capitalism will work fine once we all realise that being richer than everyone else is a mug's game and does not make you happy. we all just need to get by and look after each other, and i think we'll find that if that's what we want to use it for, capitalism's actually pretty good for purpose. this is all happening anyway, you don't need to do anything. how much shit gets fucked up in the meantime by greedy stupid dickheads who think enumerated economic success is any measure of anything other than what a selfish worthless shit you're prepared to be, or that it will ever make anyone actually happy, well, we'll see. in the meantime, live your life and stop trying to find something easy to blame for what's wrong with it. politicians will not save us, maybe if we stop asking them to they'll go back to doing their actual jobs (running the civil service, justice system and defence) and stop fucking everything up instead. maybe if we all stop glorifying the wealthy and powerful, they'll stop even being arsed to be wealthy and powerful (i mean, it looks like a fucking nightmare to me - why the fuck would you bother if you weren't being egged on the whole time and told that it's the only way anyone matters) and we can all just get on with looking out for each other and fostering the sorts of communities that actually do make people happy. it won't happen overnight, and it won't fix everything, but it won't happen at all if we keep expecting miracles and keep trying to tear down everything that lets us live better than people ever have. capitalism does not suck, it where all of our prosperity and freedom comes from, it is why we are not living in the squalor, violence and oppression of the middle ages any more - stop trying to tear it down, just live better, take moral responsibilty for your own life and we will all have the moral high ground to shame people who accumulate wealth and power beyond what is healthy. eventually. in about 4026. if we do not all burn or starve first. there isn't really an alternative, though... and, i mean you can order weed on the fucking internet these days!!! whaddya want out of life???

"and, i mean you can order weed on the fucking internet these days!!! whaddya want out of life??" yeah exactly wtf is wrong with people lol

I read pretty much all of this in Bill Burrs voice

Start building guillotine napping stations for all billionaires to have a nice lil lay down, acquire and distribute the hoarded resources. Job done. EDIT: to highlight i am being deliberately OTT btw n not literally advocating mass execution. but it does feel like this whole system needs an overhaul, crazy how much the top 1% has hoarded compared to the rest of the world 🤷‍♂️ how is that just?

"distribute the hoarded resources" exactly, it really is wealth hoarding. Just make wealth cap, a big one $300M... How many fucking yachts do you need, how many houses...etc. Once your wonderful business acumen took you to cap level you get a medal, respect and you go onto super wall of best humans ie elite celebrities and your additional profits get distributed to less fortunate who we're not lucky to be born smart or healthy or rich or whatever.. It's just life lottery most the time nothing to do with your efforts.. Your success can not be justified.. You don't choose your genes... Is there really good argument against wealth cap?

not much of the rich's wealth is in luxury items. it's mostly capital for production.

We need to try to start standing up for what is right and see through what the political elites are implementing all over Europe.

Between the Bilderberg group and the likes of George Soros who funds all the chaos and gets very rich from the volatility that is creates in the markets.

Every time there is a major problem all the government does is rush in new laws to clamp us down even more, they are not interested in harmony it does not fit there narrative they like to divide and conquer and keep us in small groups as we are easier to control.

The Catholic church is taking it up the Gary glitter also along with the Church of England who are just as bad all whilst the UN seems to be building an army in Europe.

This is a by proxy war we are in and it is only going to get worse from here the only way we can stop this is by all standing together as humans and taking on this tyranny.

There are people being found frozen to death in cars in the UK at the moment , big groups of people living in tents in the woods right now ffs!!.

There is an evil agenda at play that these sick inbreed elites are trying to hide from us all and unless we all stand together we are all going to get screwed even more.

We would rather watch sky sports and fuck about on FB and Insta than get off out backsides and do what is right.

The whole thing stinks and needs to be called out and stop calling people racist for pointing out the truth.

exit strategy

Wishful thinking, the leading VR platform is Facebook. You think you are surrounded with web surveillance? These are the good old days.

How can the rest of the world let this happen? They've rejected Facebook's crypto coin pretty easily.

It hasn't happened yet. The VR story is yet to be told

People are just people.

Cheers BB

Not for long bigga

UK is going to shits

As long as an authority is collecting taxes you are always going to wind up in the same place. Power will be used to obtain the money and money will be used to obtain power to get more money. These are rules of nature.

reminds me that there is nothing more organic than shit.

Swap some of your bitcoin into chainlink and ethereum and wait for the boom, cash out and take yourself off to thailand where you can live like a king, my exit strategy lol

Oh the revolution is coming… tbh it’s looking more and more appealing 😂

I think there has always been feudalism in one form or another. There is always a class that ultimately owns everything because they can confiscate it, grant it a "title" or tax it. This premise always leads to same outcome it's just a matter of how greedy or insane the current landlord is.

Everything consolidates one way or another, thats why decentralization is both great and doomed.

Anthropologist David Graeber did a book about about this myth called Debt. There is no evidence for class dominant economics bar this relatively small and recent period of time. Obviously the myth has more value than the reality.

probably starting from the neolithic era yes with the only exception of the 20th century, the only period of history where people got a bit of control of the power. Now is going to be lost for decades to come.

We need to look on the bright side, we are actually free serfs. We are free to seek a new master and we can seek redress in the crown courts, unfree serfs couldn't. However if we hadn't spent so much bit coin here we might actually be free with the value of it now.

sometimes a imagine a stack of the coins over time and shiver. so then i buy more weed.

Wise words, Jared Diamond's Guns, Germs and Steel says the same but takes 350 odd pages.

I call it digital feaudalism. And yes, we have never really exited the feudal system. It just morphs and transforms, keeping the 1% at the top, making almost all the rest their slaves.

yes, were hard wired for this shit

Nice hook

Thanks for sharing.

I see examples of this not just on the internet but in all industries. Walk down most high streets here in the UK and they now pretty much all look identical the same shops, coffee shops and chain restaurants with very few independent offerings. The cost of rent, business rates and all the red tape make it pretty much impossible nowadays for small independents to even start up.

Watching a show about fisherman on the BBC painted a picture of the EU quota system they must use and how the industry is dominated by money and huge boats and how these owners buy up small fishing boats and take the quotas these boats have to use on the mega trawlers.

The car industry seems totally monopolised now and we actually get very little choice - notice how the different makers share chassis and engines and the only real difference you get is the interior and badge. Everything else is pretty much controlled by rules and regulations.

It is obvious that these big players of industry are in cahoots with the those that set the rules and regulations as we saw with the emissions scandal with VW and EU collaboration.

Covid and lockdowns have exacerbated the situation as many small business owners left without any financial supports have gone to the wall while government loans to the huge corporations sit unused in their bank accounts.

Truly depressing times.

This is the model dreamed up by Gabrielle D'Nunzio, Mussolini, Franco and later tried by Stroessner, Pinochet and Thatcher. Always fails cos tho i am a committed capitalist even i realise extraction cannot work for ever as either you run out of victims (Franco, Pinochet) or the victims turn on you (Mussolini, Thatcher) At least Il Duce didn't cry when his turn came, Thatcher mewled and puked like a rat.

thatcher was as much a military dictator as she was latin

Fascinating. Bleak. truly people have been brainwashed by the media and now vote with their wallets. Far more regulation required at the top end, we cant stop the progress, and in many ways it serves us well. Democracy can still win the day, and we can unite for the good of all people. Education is the key, and a few good humans can change the world. It cant be allowed that rampant free market capitalism destroys us. Roll on technical singularity, according to Moores law would be around 2042 but i believe the theory is faultering (Moores law) so might take a bit longer. Technological growth becomes uncontrollable and irreversible, resulting in unforeseeable changes to human civilization. We have just leisure time so we study philosophy and all becone enlightened beings living in a tech utopia. Peace

Moore's law is doing fine once you abstract it to include progress besides chip density. Computation overall is on track when you include advances in software and a.i.

it will take more than economics for everyone to spend their leisure time studying philosophy. but im with you at least

Hope so but would we be the same beings, even the same species? I think Nietszche was mostly a clown but "homo, ecce homo" hits home

What is Neo Feudalism and being British mean?

Neo-feudalism refers to a concept that draws parallels between modern societal structures and the feudal system of the Middle Ages. It suggests that power and wealth are concentrated in the hands of a few influential individuals or entities, leading to a significant wealth disparity and limited social mobility. In a neo-feudalistic system, there may be an entrenched hierarchy, with a small elite class exerting control over economic, political, and social aspects, while the majority of the population faces limited opportunities and struggles to improve their circumstances.

Being British refers to being a citizen or a resident of the United Kingdom or having a connection to British culture and heritage. It typically implies a sense of national identity associated with the customs, traditions, and values of the British people. It encompasses aspects such as the English language, British history, British institutions, and cultural practices that are prevalent in the UK. However, it's important to note that "being British" can mean different things to different people, as it can encompass a diverse range of identities and perspectives within the multicultural society of the United Kingdom,

digital land barons & their consumers

Like the last feudal era they will ultimately fail IMO. Biden, bezos, bj and the two conos in NZ & Canada are only one mad bomber away from losing all the kleptocratic gains they have extracted. Putin and Xi poss a battalion or two away. Even if the above are stopped there are always despots trying their luck. The better angels of our nature (thanks Pinker, S) have always stayed in the fight so that the new boss is NOT always the same as the old boss (thanks Townshend, P)

When banks create a new loan they must also create an equal and opposite liability, in the form of a new demand deposit. Meaning when banks loan they create money out of thin air. They simply make it exist.

There is a really good series on YouTube that goes in to great depth about how it all works.

https://www.youtube.com/user/whygoldandsilver

nice man, thanks for sharing will 100% be putting this on later

I binged watched the series in one night. No regrets haha. Really gets the brain matter flowing. That link is to his main channel, it seems he has a lot of new content. Even some videos on crypto.

This is the link to his main series I was talking about, that goes in to great depth on banking, the federal reserve, fiat currency and economics as a whole. Enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DyV0OfU3-FU&list=PLE88E9ICdipidHkTehs1VbFzgwrq1jkUJ

thanks muchly, think you might like richard werner

I do indeed. Interesting solutions. Mike's series (if I remember correctly, it's been a few years) doesn't really go in to any solutions to the many economical issues we have, if at all. So this was a nice listen. Ty!

Quantitative Easing.

The ECB have been doing it for years, with no federal reserve at all.

All countries do it to a greater or lesser extent.

The reason the (US) dollar is so popular is they have a federal reserve (gold).

The reason the Euro is failing is it's based upon the German banks and their megalomaniacal desire to control Europe.

There is no EU federal reserve. Only German banks.

When the EU (and Euro) collapses, Germany will be fine, the other 26 member states will fail.

Invest as you will.

Cheers. BB

Petrodollar is interesting on another topic. What do you think ? It’s funny what is out there that the vast majority of people do not know about in the financial and political landscape. The petrodollar is perplexing to me

Money is just an I Owe U ... it says so on your GBP £ notes ! something like ... ''I promise to pay the bearer the sum of twenty pounds'' .... hmmm? but you are handing over a physical £20 note made out of paper or plastic. BUT it still is an I OWE YOU, because the actual note is a ''promise TO pay'' .. the note is not backed up by gold anymore...back in the day... money was real... now it is just digital numbers on screens, according to my limited knowledge about it. I will keep up with this thread tho, as I would like to hear what others on LB think :)

Banks also "Trade Client" funds in a range of assets from , bonds, to stocks hence why you will receive interest each month or annually on your account; that is miniscule compared to what they generate from trading your funds (which is also why your funds are insured). but there are many aspects to this and variables as i've read below each of which is pretty much true.

Spot on smokey!

"since banks work as the accountants of record – while the rest of the economy assumes they are honest accountants – it is possible for the banks to increase the money in the accounts of some of us (those who receive a loan), by simply altering the figures. Nobody else will notice, because agents cannot distinguish between money that had actually been saved and deposited and money that has been created ‘out of nothing’ by the bank” - Richard Werner

Yes if they say its "in the bank" that's all it takes to do what they want with it - regardless of whether it exists.

Banks literally print money and we are expected to accept it has value when in actual fact there is nothing backing fiat currencies anymore. Used to be that dollar was backed by gold reserves then oil but now its backed by the promise... Basically the whole world is in a debt/credit spiral that will unravial at some point...

The dollar will collapse, thank me later

CBDC coming soon.. to a place near you!

(Not Financial Advice) 🥸

One word. Credit.

They don't create money, they create an illusion. Pepe is the only money worth anything

Money printer go brrr

All began with financial deregulation in the 1970’s . The banks just click some buttons and magic. Then you pay them back, what a business!!!

This is a major cause of inflation. They are putting money that hasn’t been earned yet from the future in todays circulation . That’s why our money 💰 s worth fuck all now. Well one of the many reasons;)

I thought we just discovered all money, is in fact, cake.

not individual banks! but they do make money lol dont make much sense does it

little ben

yes, individual banks, check out the werner stuff in this thread. basically it's just accounting that makes them book things twice. if it's on a bank's books it is money.

When a bank makes a loan it is creating fiat currency

It grows on trees

It's depending on the existing customers within the bank actually , so you deposit money into the so called bank but in fact the bank lends it to other people within the banking system and charges interest on that.
Banks are the only ones legally able to create wealth out of thin air , digits on the computer.
For example when you get a loan - digits , but you have return back with interest to the bank Real money from your job , revenue streams.
Circular Banking.

It's all about complex energy numbers.

They don't, they make up fiat currency (£, $, € ect ect) just a bar code number to give it a vaule. Money is only something that can be equally treaded fairly ie gold.

good thread :)

Yes Werner's study explains the double ledger. The implications being that when you deposit your own fiat, what is really happening is that the banks are purchasing security futures from you with promises to pay. The b of e charter actually explains that they cannot and do not lend money or take deposits.
White rabbit trust on YouTube and youandyourcash.com seek and example plenty of successful remedy.

I think capitalism ends in so much abundance that no one gives a shit.

0% interest rates, meme stocks, puts and calls going up simultaneously, sure looks like an end game scenario.

We're in the widening gap phase now for sure, or at least its becoming clear how far the gap already is.

The final step in every Marxism based cycle is the uprising of the proletariat, so that's the fun bit we need to look towards.. lol :)

WS

The big flaw of capitalism..
One day all the super rich (super useless) will realize the world seizes to go round without ground level hard workers and skilled people.

you mean robots, right? ;0

I doubt Communism unfolded exactly how he predicted... so at least he got it half right.

Cheers BB 😁👍🍻💚

Not quite. "The working class cannot simply lay hold of the ready-made state machinery, and wield it for its own purposes".

Too true 😅

i dont think steve jobs would have been at all satisfied with the lack of innovation. cook managed earnings, jobs managed product.

monero is :)